?

Log in

Previous Entry | Next Entry

It's FAMILY [/bad guy ritchie movie]

1) If you've never listened to Heaven or Las Vegas by the Cocteau Twins, why not?

2) I am apparently at that stage of tinhattery where I will read *anything*, no matter how dreadful, because it's got the people I want to read about in it. I've been here before. I didn't like it.
2a) People who write Martha Jones/Donna Noble femmeslash called it MaDonna. Well, of course they do.
2b) If you've not been there, go watch this vid: Don't Lose Yourself. It is brilliant.
2c) ChisWICK, people. Look on a map.
2d) I love fandom. Well, I don't *love* fandom in the febrile nether stirrings way, [I apologise for this image right now] but I love it in a deep abiding love sort of way. I love the fact that there are people out there, many of them American and thus forced to noodle about on YouTube looking at La Liga highlights from Saudi Arabian broadcast TV, who write lengthy slash series about Sergio Ramos and Fernando Torres or the deep abiding love of Steven Gerrard for Xabi Alonso. Much of the slash seems to centre on Liverpool and Real Madrid/Barcelona. Cos they're the prettiest. No one wants to slash Rio Ferdinand.

I haven't been reading it. No, really, I haven't. There are *some* limits. Not many, but some.

And no one gives Wayne Rooney any love. I suspect it may be a looking-like-Shrek issue. They only want to write about footballers with long flowing hair. Apparently there's some huge shipping war going on right now, a complicated thing to do with the Spanish national team and I think there were Germans involved and it was all very tortured and a spectacle demanding popcorn. I am quite glad I've lost the link.

However, it is amusing to transport oneself back in time and imagine 18-year-olds writing slash about the European Cup-winning Liverpool teams of the 70s and 80s. Mostly because of the thought of Graeme Souness finding out about it.

3) Oh *God* when does the football season start? It seems like years since I was at Wembley, beside myself with excitement, alongside thousands of other fans who were practically widdling themselves with joy, bellowing "Deeeeeanoooooo!" and singing "Show Me The Way To Amarillo" like their lives depended on it. Footballers are knob-ends but I love football.

4) Me and a friend, who is in Milan, drinking cocktails right now, the jammy bastard, were having this discussion about the new rules of modern communication and I was wondering which hold true for you
Poll #1237955 Modern life is rubbish

Is it now weird and creepy to phone someone on their home landline

Yes
5(13.9%)
No
20(55.6%)
Are you high?
11(30.6%)

In London the rule is drinks with colleagues on Thursday, drinks with friends on Friday. Is this the rule for you?

Yes
3(8.6%)
No
21(60.0%)
Sometimes
10(28.6%)
Dipsomania ahoy!
1(2.9%)


R thinks it's creepy that you should call someone on their landline because you are deliberately evading their call filtering process on their mobile. M thinks that you save Friday nights for mates, which is why London is full of drunk people on a Thursday -- and oh my God, if you've ever caught the last train out of Liverpool Street on Thursday you know the true meaning of the word drunk.

5) In "the credit crunch is just something that happens to other people" news, I was talking to this bloke the other day who had just spent £700 on a meal for three at a Japanese restaurant. Oh, when will the glorious socialist revolution happen?

6) I went to see The Dark Knight today. If it were a boyfriend, it would be the devastatingly good-looking one who dressed all in black, practised a martial art and insisted on quoting from L'Etranger in French and discussing the darkness in his soul at endless bloody length. And you're all lovely to him and put up with him quoting Nietzche in bed and then he chucks you for a wilder woman and the next time you see him he's in slacks and working for NatWest. Hmmm. I seem to have come off the rails at the end there a bit.

Seriously, I have seldom seen a movie more pompously impressed with itself and also hopped up on its own violence. It should also have been called "Harvey Dent" since that's what it was about. I am not saying it is a bad movie, just that it is a bit pretentious and in love with itself and with extreme violence which would in reality kill scores of people and I don't like those two things much. However, Michael Caine was joy. Also, aside from Melissa Scully, did any woman with lines actually survive that film? And did they even bother giving Gordon's other wee sprite of a kid a name? I am assuming it was a girl, since they didn't. I am *really* getting sick of that.

7) Which leads me on to this: I have forgiven in shows/films I love *far* greater flaws than I saw in The Dark Knight. I have this theory that some entertainmenty things -- books, films, graphic novels, TV shows -- are like friends and some are like family.

You might cut a friend off if s/he does something which is offensive and awful but for family you accommodate and explain and make allowances for hideous script issues, bad writing, appalling subtext, sometimes to the point of madness.

And when family betray you past the point of forgiveness, that's when the bitterness kicks in. Hence the "I am *never* watching this show again" posts you see after finales. I completely understand the mindset.

For further ref, shows which are family to me: Doctor Who, The X-Files, DS9, Spooks (but I am teetering, man, seriously teetering...), The West Wing

What's family to you?

Comments

( 51 comments — Leave a comment )
ropo
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:08 pm (UTC)
5) did that include the airfare to Japan?? W.T.F.???

Poll: We in the USA don't go out every Thursday and/or Friday. We stay home on the internets. Many workplaces are left completely behind the moment you're done working. And with good reason. You spend 40+ hours with those heinous people as it is. Socializing with them would be HELL.
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:46 pm (UTC)
Kobe beef and a £150 bottle of wine apparently.

As for socialising with your work colleagues, a lot of mine go out to the pub with each other every night. I can't fathom it myself (not that they ask me)
(no subject) - cofax7 - Aug. 10th, 2008 01:34 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - infinitemonkeys - Aug. 10th, 2008 10:46 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - cofax7 - Aug. 10th, 2008 04:30 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - infinitemonkeys - Aug. 10th, 2008 07:14 pm (UTC) - Expand
kirbyfest
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:10 pm (UTC)
They did not give Gordon's daughter a name OR a face, and I suspect it's deliberate (not insulting)-- because remember, Gordon's daughter is Barbara Gordon. And in Batcanon, Barbara is Batgirl. They were leaving themselves wiggle/casting room, methinks.

Harvey Dent should have interested me. He did not.

Edited at 2008-08-09 10:11 pm (UTC)
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:47 pm (UTC)
I think maybe I should've known that. If it wasn't a pattern I wouldn't be narked
(no subject) - kirbyfest - Aug. 9th, 2008 11:42 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - se_parsons - Aug. 11th, 2008 05:01 pm (UTC) - Expand
omphalos
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:17 pm (UTC)
When I worked in London (during the late eighties/early nineties - oh what fun), it was definitely the Friday evening trains that were the scary ones. Apparently things have changed. :)

Only someone far from the breadline could have that bizarre attitude about mobiles/landlines. Tell R that believe it or not, you can set up call filtering on landline phones too. ;)

I completely agree re shows becoming like family and therefore more easily forgiven for their flaws, but when things go really wrong, grudges can be held that can last a lifetime.
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:50 pm (UTC)
I don't wish to imply that the Friday trains have got any better. The 0:55 pisshead express remains a hideous experience

Only someone far from the breadline could have that bizarre attitude about mobiles/landlines. Tell R that believe it or not, you can set up call filtering on landline phones too. ;)

You know, you're absolutely right. It's 13 years since I had to make choices between heating and eating something other than baked beans (as ever with me, eating won; I wore two jumpers) and I forget how fortunate we are to work where we work with its minimum wage and decent holidays.

If I were in the same position now, I would get a pay as you go mobile and sod the landline. But then I do answer the phone most of the time and R really, really doesn't
tabula_x_rasa
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:30 pm (UTC)
But I want to see the footballer slash wank! Not enough to google it myself though, obv.

I think it is a bit creepy to call someone on their land line unless invited to so? I keep trying to get my friends to call me on my land line because I am a cheap bastard when it comes to minutes, but they never do. Ergo, it is creepy. But the caller ID usually shows up so it's not like it really circumvents the screening process.

That friends and family thing is completely true! I never thought of it that way, but, yes. That's it. Family shows: XF, Doctor Who, ST:TNG, Life On Mars, and I guess Rome. I have like immediate and extended family levels. Harry Potter is family too, but you were just talking about tv shows.
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:52 pm (UTC)
I am sorry that I can't remember where it is but if you google Torres, Ramos and Alonso you'll probably come upon it.

It was very funny, if you're not involved.
musesfool
Aug. 9th, 2008 10:38 pm (UTC)
I really like the some shows are family analogy. Like, X-Files was a friend for me - we grew apart and I missed it, but it wasn't a traumatic split, whereas Gilmore Girls was like my sister and we had a huge rift that was papered over so we could be polite at family functions, but there's still a lot of unresolved anger simmering beneath.

West Wing is like your favorite uncle who suddenly becomes a republican after he gets married, but you still remember how awesome he used to be, so you don't cut him off - he's still family, after all.

Right now, for me, House is like an obnoxious friend I've finally gotten tired of making excuses for, while Supernatural is my favorite brother whose behavior sometimes makes me cringe, or hurts me, but he's really not that bad all the time, I swear. He just has issues. But we hope he's working on them now.

Hmmm...
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 9th, 2008 11:04 pm (UTC)
I like your comparisons. For me, X-Files is a tortured and a complicated relationship that's been through its "I wish I knew how to quit you!" period and settled back into affection, mostly. DS9 was the slightly pompous older brother who was quietly awesome; West Wing was the much-loved cousin who was all kinds of marvellous when you were young and couldn't see his issues, but then went through this hideous phase where you noticed the flaws that had been there all along and he was a total jackass, but then just at the end there, he regained his excellence.

What was it about Gilmore Girls that made you feud?
(no subject) - musesfool - Aug. 9th, 2008 11:10 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - infinitemonkeys - Aug. 9th, 2008 11:29 pm (UTC) - Expand
parthenia14
Aug. 9th, 2008 11:12 pm (UTC)
I love that video.
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 9th, 2008 11:27 pm (UTC)
Me too, but it makes me sad.
(no subject) - parthenia14 - Aug. 9th, 2008 11:30 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - katie_m - Aug. 10th, 2008 01:09 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - infinitemonkeys - Aug. 10th, 2008 10:48 am (UTC) - Expand
eloiseinparis
Aug. 9th, 2008 11:44 pm (UTC)
Seriously, I have seldom seen a movie more pompously impressed with itself and also hopped up on its own violence. [snip] I am not saying it is a bad movie, just that it is a bit pretentious and in love with itself

AH!! Would that I had been able to say the same so concisely and precisely.
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 9th, 2008 11:54 pm (UTC)
You weren't completely bowled over either? That makes me feel a bit better. I am always worried that it's something I've missed.
(no subject) - eloiseinparis - Aug. 10th, 2008 01:18 am (UTC) - Expand
violetisblue
Aug. 9th, 2008 11:48 pm (UTC)
"What's family to you?"

Mystery Science Theater 3000 and all its associated spinoffs are the kindly older brother who married a nice woman, had some nice kids, live in a nice town rather like yours and while they're not the most exciting people in the world, they're loyal and loving and enjoy mocking their neighbors and yours to an inordinate degree. Doctor Who is the weird British uncle who drops in on odd occasions whenever he feels like it, sometimes with wonderful presents, sometimes with an annoying doe-eyed bimbo on his arm and oftentimes both, and it's always a tossup whether his visits will be amazingly fun or a facepalming disaster but when the latter happens, well, he is one of those weird foreigners, you know, he can't help it.
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 9th, 2008 11:53 pm (UTC)
We don't get Mystery Science Theatre here but I was once in Chicago at a dear friend's house, jetlagged out of my mind and watched a film and I swear, I nearly coughed up something vital laughing.

As for Doctor Who, it's just slipped past my defences completely. I have loved it inordinately for 28 years and being cross with it makes me feel sad.

I like your description though. My dad is "one of those weird foreigners" in real life so I think I know exactly what you mean. He mostly enjoys winding up very proper English people.
(no subject) - violetisblue - Aug. 10th, 2008 12:05 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - infinitemonkeys - Aug. 10th, 2008 10:50 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - violetisblue - Aug. 10th, 2008 09:17 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - infinitemonkeys - Aug. 10th, 2008 09:40 pm (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - violetisblue - Aug. 10th, 2008 09:50 pm (UTC) - Expand
sophia_helix
Aug. 10th, 2008 12:01 am (UTC)
A number of things bothered me about TDK, but the weird attitude towards violence was near the top of the list -- "I'll crash my motorcycle to avoid hitting the villain so he can be arrested instead, but I have no problems flipping a huge truck down the middle of a crowded street." I had similar issues with the first movie, such as when he knocked down most of the public transportation system his own father built.

I very much like the family-fandoms metaphor, though I think it only applies for me when I was actually involved in the fandom as the show aired and experienced the real ups and downs without knowing what was coming. X-Files is the estranged and unstable parent with whom I can sit down and have a wonderful time for a while, but I know that the crazy and unpleasant outbreaks will show up soon and I'll need to get out. Buffy is the cool sister who got kind of boring once she got married. The Office is the partner whose early passion has died down, but we've settled into a comfortable and loving lifetime relationship. Harry Potter is like a whole gang of cousins I love to go hang out with because we always have a good time and if one of them annoys me, I can always talk to one of the others.

And hm, I think that's it. I've put up with a lot from Lost, BSG, and sometimes DW, but I know any of them could push me too far and I'd only feel bad about ditching them because I'm a completist.
sophia_helix
Aug. 10th, 2008 12:02 am (UTC)
PS: I love my landline, and wish more people would call it besides my parents and a couple of friends (and a horde of telemarketers). It's easier for me to talk on the big handset because I can put it on my shoulder, and I have caller ID at home anyhow.
(no subject) - cofax7 - Aug. 10th, 2008 01:39 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - sophia_helix - Aug. 10th, 2008 02:18 am (UTC) - Expand
(no subject) - infinitemonkeys - Aug. 10th, 2008 10:53 am (UTC) - Expand
shiba_inu
Aug. 10th, 2008 01:00 am (UTC)
Commissioner Gordon's daughter, who is named Barbara, grows up to become Batgirl. The Joker makes her a paraplegic, which ends her active career as a "cape". She goes on to become Batman's (and later the Justice League's) ace in the hole as Oracle, a cyberneodemigoddess.

Just in case you were wondering.

Ahem.
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 10th, 2008 10:53 am (UTC)
Ah, thank you. I think I had learned about Batgirl through fannish osmosis, but I didn't know she was Oracle
herself_nyc
Aug. 10th, 2008 01:08 am (UTC)
I just know I hate being called on my land-line, and am THIS CLOSE to getting rid of the thing altogether and putting that $35/mo towards something else ….
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 10th, 2008 10:55 am (UTC)
Yeah, a friend of mine is about to do the same -- and it's the norm in many parts of Africa, I read. They've skipped the stage where everyone has a landline at home. If we can get secure mobile numbers which are entirely portable then I might consider it
(Deleted comment)
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 10th, 2008 10:58 am (UTC)
Re: If I didn't love you already...
I totally admire you for walking out. I've only ever walked out of something once (Rent, in the West End, felt very liberating). I didn't want to walk out because the spectacle was quite something but I was uncomfortable. I don't think it's a bad movie but I hate what it's saying. There's a moment late on in the movie where two sets of characters decide to do the right thing and it felt as though it stuck out and was wrong because the entirety of the rest of the movie was about how scum-sucking humanity is.

If I ever find more hairpulling over footie RPS, I'll post the link.
aud_woman_in
Aug. 10th, 2008 07:32 am (UTC)
Family: XF, natch, and also West Wing and Friday Night Lights. See also St. Elsewhere, Mad Men, Slings and Arrows, Bill Moyers Journal, The Sopranos, China Beach, Six Feet Under and The Office.

Current Friends: In Plain Sight, which is just wrapping up its first season and is so far delightful, but who knows what the future may bring? Ditto Swingtown. I would add Californication to this list, though it's really more like a relationship I know is bad for me, but the guy's Svengali-like hold on me cannot be broken.

Ex-Friends: 24, ER, Law & Order, NYPD Blue, which I remember fondly, on the whole, knowing full well we drifted apart about half-way through the run. Veronica Mars is totally the show I would have welcomed as an adopted sister if she hadn't dumped me been kidnapped, brainwashed, forced to rob banks and then disappeared into the mists.
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 10th, 2008 10:59 am (UTC)
I love your descriptions of Californication and Veronica Mars. I think they about sum it all up.
aud_woman_in
Aug. 10th, 2008 07:36 am (UTC)
As for socializing with workmates, there are certain periods of time where we might conceivably be working together 19 days out of 21, and we'll still go out for drinks after a concert or a day in the office. Dunno if that's utopia or really really pathetic. *shrugs*
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 10th, 2008 11:01 am (UTC)
Not pathetic at all. It's wonderful that you like your workmates well enough. Mine can be a good laugh, it's just the endless bitching I can't bear -- and I speak as someone who is totally guilty of bitching a lot; it's something I really dislike about myself
curiouswombat
Aug. 10th, 2008 06:04 pm (UTC)
Steven Gerrard/Xabi Alonso etc.

Meep! How did I not know about this whole genre?

I was totally mind boggled at the idea - then thought of the 70s and 80s possibilities and had to go and lie down at the thought of Graham Souness/Kevin Keagan fic..... mere boggling was insufficient!

Your summing up of the Dark Knight seems to concur with my daughter's opinion - I think the phrase 'pretentious twaddle' cropped up when she got home from seeing it with friends. I decided not to bother...
infinitemonkeys
Aug. 10th, 2008 07:18 pm (UTC)
Oh me either. I can't even remember how I found it, just that I was inexorably drawn in by the whole footie RPS idea. Some of the fun was admittedly imagining various people's heads exploding at the mere idea of it.

I quite like the idea of there being England World Cup Team of the 60s slash writers. Nobby Stiles/Jack Charlton? It's all so implausible and wrong. And yet they're out there wildly slashing Cristiano Ronaldo as we speak.
se_parsons
Aug. 11th, 2008 05:14 pm (UTC)
Hmmm, I have a feeling that my incredible love for Dark Knight comes from having grown up reading the stories that inspired it. The dark, evil badness of humanity stuff that was rife in comics in those days. I mean you had Frank Miller writing Batman, so think about it. This was straight up Miller with his total hatred of humanity done big on screen.

And, actually I thought the violence loved itself a bit less than you did, but maybe I'm reading in backstory from my own head, having read all the same sources as Nolan.

The whole point of this one was the insane levels of escalation the Joker was bringing to the violence - because of what Batman had already done. And the random anarchic terror and pointlessness was what he was attempting to accomplish. Alfred was the guy who told you all about that, and joker did later, too.

I think the movie was kind of smart, actually. Because that kind of escalated violence is absolutely what superheroes would inspire. Just like gang violence continues to escalate.

A. and I were talking after we saw it, and I mentioned that what it reminded me MOST of wasn't the Miller Batman, but Brat Pack by Rick Vietch - the darkest comic series ever written.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bratpack_(comics)

I know that I saw those things in Dark Knight, and I think they were actually in the script, not just in my head. And they are ongoing themes in the comics.

Batman has made some things worse by his very appearance. And also a few things better.
( 51 comments — Leave a comment )

Latest Month

January 2017
S M T W T F S
1234567
891011121314
15161718192021
22232425262728
293031    
Powered by LiveJournal.com
Designed by Tiffany Chow